Help needed

[Koi]

Ok people got this e mail from a Surf owner via the web site, soon to register on here. In the mean time read his mail and see if we can help please.

Dec 1992 Toyota Hi –Lux Surf SSG-X EFI Turbo Diesel LN130 2LTE. I had 9 months trouble–free motoring (11,000kms) when one day she started to boil on the way home, Head gasket? Nope, corroded head plus two corroded liners & bores, scrap! I decided to import another engine (exactly the same type) and this was fully re-built by API. Absolute bugger to fit but, it ran perfectly for another 4,000km. Until I hitched–up my caravan (lightweight only 1100kgs) for the first time since the re-build when 5km down the road she cut out dead! She re-started o.k. but with a slight “camy” knock (like Diesel knock I’m told) Oil pressure o.k.,Coolant Temp o.k., ran fine except for the Knocking/tapping and a slight lack of power, but that may have been the way I gently drove her home!

Now, no oil was lost no coolant was lost, as (to me) it sounded a bit like Hydraulic lifters I flushed the oil out completely put new in, but no change, I drained 2lts of Diesel from the Tank, this was fine, I bled the filter, no muck, I bled each injector in turn, found no air and she ran fine on any three cylinders. I took the injectors back to the firm the re-conditioned them and they tested o.k.

She starts first pull every-time, ticks over perfect on both cold and warm, Oil pressure is exactly the same as since fitted. Other than the Knocking she does blow greyish smoke when revved! I finally got her booked into a Diesel pump specialist (the fella’s that re-conned and put new nozzles on the injectors) I tried to start her for the first time since Xmas (to put her on the trailer) but the batteries were dead. I charged these, put them back on Sunday, she started first pull, same story. However, once warmed up I gave her a couple of revs and the engine-management warning light came on
Perhaps I jolted a bad connection? But all the electrics worked fine before? And this light always came on with the key (as it should) then extinguished. Up to this point I was convinced my problem was Diesel pump phasing/timing, possibly something to do with the knock sensor system (which nobody seems to understand, or believe exists!) so I put all my eggs in the “have the pump professionally tested” basket, but now I think the problem could be electronic, perhaps ECU or Computer? As I can’t find any bugger who has the software in the U.K. to run the ECU or effectively test the management system I’m knackered! Up to now I’ve avoided contacting API as I’m scared of invalidating the warranty because I fitted the engine as supplied, all the ancillaries are my responsibility! (I did change everything except the Pump as this seemed fine!).

Finally, the only other thing worth knowing, because of the Surf’s overheating reputation, I fitted a capillary thermostat (to run the electric cooling fan at a lower temperature) a few days before my ill-fated attempt to go on holiday! I unplugged the connector from the loom (I’m not sure where or which Temp sensor fed this?) and took the power from one of the batteries via a correct relay, locating the adjustment switch on the viscous fan shroud (which works fine). I doubt if this is relevant, you’ll know if it is?

Sorry, my tale is so long-winded but without the vehicle to look at, you’ll need all the detail, or you will be as lost as I am! (Perhaps).

[high-surfer]

First thing I would suggest is have alook at this thread posted by Marky. And try to pull some codes off your ECU. This will at least give you some piece of mind.

Sorry to here of your wo's, I'm sure as a collective we can fight this illness and return the surfing smile to your face. Haha.

Ian


About half of the ECU codes stored on the first & second generation EFI Toyotas don't show a constant blinking check engine light therefore you must pull the ECU codes to see if a fault is registered.
To pull the ECU codes:

All 1980-1995 and including 1995 EFI equipped vehicle allow you to find engine and related faults by pulling the ECU (computer) codes without the need for a handheld OBDII diagnosis scanner,the sites listed below have the fault codes needed to pull the codes and the instructions on how to do it:

http://autorepair.about.com/library/ts/bl-dtcs-10a.htm
http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/codes/index.html
http://www.geocities.com/MotorCity/...ect/Engine.html
http://www.mad-mechanic.com/toyota/...html#obtaincode
http://www.freewebs.com/th3duke/22RE-ECU.mht
http://www.batauto.com/Toyota
http://www.anewtoronto.com/toyotacodes.htm
http://www.floathouse.com/ACE/Toyota.htm
http://www.showmesome.info/hilux/in...TE/Page0096.htm
http://www.efisakh.narod.ru/at_toyota.htm
http://www.usatransdoctor.com/foreigntoyota.htm

If a fault is not stored then take voltage and resistancd measurements at each ECU pin and compare with the factory service manual that technique will pin point your problem as this is the technique that I use when troubleshooting tv's,vcr's,home/car audio equipment.

[rubblebags]

Hi all

When I realised that my first Surf's turbo was not working, I tried extensivily to find a garage to plug into my a Diagnosis and tell me my trouble. To no avail. Eventualy I went to Jemcar ( Toyota ) service shop.
They told me that there was not a machine for the surf.??????
They then said that they would have to pull the codes from the dash board.
They did this and said they would email Japan with them to find out what they related to. They did and £40 later I still have the problem. It appeares that anyone finding a place that can just plug in is on a gold mine.
If these codes are given off by the ECU and it is fauty what chance do we have.?
Sorry to be a misery guts on this one but I spent a lot of hard earned cash on the subject. Hope one of our well gened up boys can help our new member.

Geoff.

[marky]

MORE INFO
All Toyota vehicles with electronic fuel injection utilize the Toyota EFI or TCCS engine management system. This system incorporates many features to enhance performance, emissions, and drivability. One feature is the Self Diagnostic System. The self diagnostic system monitors engine operations and when a particular sensor or input varies out of specified operating parmeters, the "Check Engine" will be illuminated.

The check engine lamp alerts the driver or technician that a problem exists in the EFI/TCCS ECU or Engine Control Unit or "computer." When the check engine light is illuminated, it is indicating that a problem in the engine management system has been detected. At this time, a "code" may be stored in the ECU which pinpoints a possible component in the EFI/TCCS system. By checking the trouble codes, a possible problem could be narrowed down to a number of causes. While not an exact diagnostic tool, the check engine light and self-diagnostic system can get the individual working on his/her truck close to a possible fault, and, hopefully, to a successful repair.

Listed below are one and two digit trouble codes for the EFI/TCCS systems and possible causes. As mentioned above, this is not an exact science. Many other component failures can cause similar symptoms that can "mask" the actual cause. EFI/TCCS computer interrogation is one of the last steps to engine diagnostics. A thourough inspection of the simple items should be done prior to any computer-related repairs. Sometimes it's the simple things that will get ya'. In addition, use caution when working on the electrical system of your vehicle. Not only is the electrical system delicate to water, static electricity, and outright physical abuse, the ignition system puts out high voltage as well and you can be serioulsy injured if you do not exercise basic safety.

READING THE TROUBLE CODES

Reading the diagnostic trouble codes is very easy. You will need a paper clip to short the check connectors of the diagnostic connector. The diagnostic connector comes in two types. The early system is located on the inner-left fender well and is a round, green connector, usually located near the air cleaner. Simply jump the two terminals in this connector with the ignition switch in the "ON" position and the engine off. Later models, '87 and newer use a multiple terminal "DIAGNOSTIC" connector which is a small, rectangular-shaped grey "box", usually located near the right fender in the enigne compartment. To get codes out of this type of connector, jump the "TE1" and "E1" teminals. Finding these terminals is easy as the inside cover of the diagnostic connector contains a schematic of the connector pinouts. If the underhood emission decal (VECI) is still intact on your vehicle, the proper pins for this are outlined there as well.

The trouble codes will appear as flashes of the check engine lamp. Be sure the ignition key is on, the engine off, and your foot off of the accelerator when reading the codes. Two different codes may appear: One-digit and two digit. One digit codes have an approximate 4.5 second delay between flashes with the check engine light illuminating for about a half of a second. Mulitiple codes have a 2.5 second delay between them. For example a code two flashes the check engine lamp two times in a little over one second: I I. If two codes are stored, such as a code two and a code four, the lamp may flash as such: ....I I....I I I I. Crude examples but you get the idea. Two digit codes are similar but will flash the lamp with the first number first and the second number last. An example of a code twleve is I ....II and a code twenty four is I I..IIII.
While a lot of the possible faults in the EFI system point to the ECU iteself, it should be noted that ECU failure is not common. The ECU should be replaced only as a last resort or if all diagnosises points to a bad ECU. Usually, troublesome EFI problems are a result of poor grounds, shorted wiring, and bad connectons at sensors.When all else fails, carefully consult your factory repair manual. It contains more comprehensive diagnostic information and great electrical wiring diagrams.

[marky]

TROUBLE CODES AND POSSIBLE CAUSES

ONE-DIGIT TWO-DIGIT POSSIBLE CAUSE OF CODE/SYMPTOM
1
NONE
SYSTEM NORMAL

--
11
LOSS OF POWER SUPPLY TO ECU
--IGNITION SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--MAIN RELAY/CIRCUIT

--ECU

6
12
RPM SIGNAL-NO SIGNAL TO ECU FROM DISTRIBUTOR ("Ne" OR "G") AFTER ENGINE HAS BEEN CRANKED
--DISTRIBUTOR/CIRCUIT

--STARTERSIGNAL CIRCUIT

--IGNITER/IGNITER CIRCUIT

--ECU

--
13
SAME AS ABOVE BUT AFTER ENGINE HAS RUN AT 1,000-1,500 RPM
--DISTRIBUTOR/DISTRIBUTOR CIRCUIT

--ECU

3
14
IGNITION SIGNAL--NO "IGF" SIGNAL TO ECU
--IGNITER/IGNITER CIRCUIT

--IGNITER AND IGNITION COIL/CIRCUIT

--ECU

5
21
OXYGEN SENSOR SIGNAL/OXYGEN SENSOR HEATER SIGNAL
OPEN OR SHORT IN OXYGEN SENSOR OR OXYGEN SENSOR SIGNAL

4
22
WATER TEMPERATURE SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN WATER TEMP. SENSOR SIGNAL
--WATER TEMPERATURE SENSOR CIRCUIT

--WATER TEMPERATURE SENSOR

--ECU

8
24
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN INTAKE AIR TEMP. SIGNAL
--INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE CIRCUIT

--INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE SENSOR

--ECU

--
25
AIR/FUEL RATIO LEAN INDICATOR--LEAN SIGNAL SENT TO ECU FROM O2 SENSOR
--INJECTOR FAULT(S)

--FUEL PRESSURE

--OXYGEN SENSOR

--AIRFLOW METER OR MAP SENSOR

--IGNITION

--ECU

--
26
AIR/FUEL RATIO RICH INDICATOR
--SAME AS ABOVE

--COLD START INJECTOR

--
27
SUB-OXYGEN SENSOR CIRCUIT OR SUB-OXYGEN SENSOR HEATER CIRCUIT
--SUB OXYGEN SENSOR/HEATER/CIRCUIT

--ECU

--
28
No.2 OXYGEN SENSOR/OXYGEN SENSOR HEATER
--SAME AS CODE 21

2
31
MANIFOLD AND/OR AIRFLOW METER SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT
--AIRFLOW METER/CIRCUIT

--MANIFOLD PRESSURE SENSOR/CIRCUIT

--ECU

--
32
AIRFLOW METER SIGNAL (VANE-TYPE)
--AIRFLOW METER./CIRCUIT

--ECU

14
34
TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE--ABNORMAL TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE
--TURBO CHARGER

--AIRFLOW METER/MANIFOLD/TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE SENSOR

--INTERCOOLER SYSTEM

--ECU

--
35
TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL
--TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE SENSOR

--ECU

7
41
THROTTLE POSITION SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN TPS SIGNAL
--TPS SENSOR

--TPS SIGNAL/CIRCUIT

--ECU

9
42
VEHICLE SPEED SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT--NO SPD. SIGNAL FOR SEVERLA SECONDS
WHILE VEHICLE IS OPERATED UNDER HEAVY LOAD (TPS/MAP/AIR FLOW INPUTS)

--SPEED SENSOR/CIRCUIT

--ECU

10
43
STARTER SIGNAL--NO "STA" SIGNAL TO ECU UNTIL ENGINE SPEED EXCEEDS 800RPM
--IGNITION SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--ECU

11
51
SWITCH SIGNALS
IDL (tps) CONTACTS OFF, NEUTRAL START SWITCH OFF, A/C SWITCH "ON" SIGNAL TO ECU

WITH DIAGNOSTIC CHECK CONNECTOR SHORTED

--A/C SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--A/C AMPLIFIER

--TPS/CIRCUIT

--NEUTRAL START SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--ECU

12
52
KNOCK SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN KNOCK SENSOR SIGNAL
--KNOCK SENSOR/CIRCUIT

ECU

13
53
KNOCK CONTROL SIGNAL IN ECU
--ECU

--
71
EGR VALVE MALFUNCTION--EXHAUST GAS TEMPEATURE BELOW SPEC. FOR EGR CONTROL
--EGR SYSTEM

--EGR GAS TEMPERATURE SENSOR/CIRCUIT

- -
72
AIR CONDITIONER COMPRESSOR RELAY/RELAY SIGNAL
--A/C COMPRESSOR RELAY/CIRCUIT

--ECU

[SSO42]

Hi Guys,

Try this site too. There is a ZIP file for the US Toyota service manual that could be very helpful. There is no diesel section though, so no help there. But the rest of the stuff such as electrics and the A/T troubleshooting has so much usefull information.

http://www.grubinski.com/grubinski/manuals.html

Good luck

[stevo]

Originally Posted by SSO42

Hi Guys,

Try this site too. There is a ZIP file for the US Toyota service manual that could be very helpful. There is no diesel section though, so no help there. But the rest of the stuff such as electrics and the A/T troubleshooting has so much usefull information.

http://www.grubinski.com/grubinski/manuals.html

Good luck

Check the Engine Earth Strap is not corroded where it is attatched to the back of the engine if your ECU red light is on, We had a Surf in our workshop that led us a merry dance and a new strap cured it.

Going back to Koi's post has the timing been checked it may have slipped a tooth if it wasn't tensioned properly in the rebuild.
Cheerio Steve.

[JimL]

Originally Posted by marky

TROUBLE CODES AND POSSIBLE CAUSES

ONE-DIGIT TWO-DIGIT POSSIBLE CAUSE OF CODE/SYMPTOM
1
NONE
SYSTEM NORMAL

--
11
LOSS OF POWER SUPPLY TO ECU
--IGNITION SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--MAIN RELAY/CIRCUIT

--ECU

6
12
RPM SIGNAL-NO SIGNAL TO ECU FROM DISTRIBUTOR ("Ne" OR "G") AFTER ENGINE HAS BEEN CRANKED
--DISTRIBUTOR/CIRCUIT

--STARTERSIGNAL CIRCUIT

--IGNITER/IGNITER CIRCUIT

--ECU

--
13
SAME AS ABOVE BUT AFTER ENGINE HAS RUN AT 1,000-1,500 RPM
--DISTRIBUTOR/DISTRIBUTOR CIRCUIT

--ECU

3
14
IGNITION SIGNAL--NO "IGF" SIGNAL TO ECU
--IGNITER/IGNITER CIRCUIT

--IGNITER AND IGNITION COIL/CIRCUIT

--ECU

5
21
OXYGEN SENSOR SIGNAL/OXYGEN SENSOR HEATER SIGNAL
OPEN OR SHORT IN OXYGEN SENSOR OR OXYGEN SENSOR SIGNAL

4
22
WATER TEMPERATURE SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN WATER TEMP. SENSOR SIGNAL
--WATER TEMPERATURE SENSOR CIRCUIT

--WATER TEMPERATURE SENSOR

--ECU

8
24
INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN INTAKE AIR TEMP. SIGNAL
--INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE CIRCUIT

--INTAKE AIR TEMPERATURE SENSOR

--ECU

--
25
AIR/FUEL RATIO LEAN INDICATOR--LEAN SIGNAL SENT TO ECU FROM O2 SENSOR
--INJECTOR FAULT(S)

--FUEL PRESSURE

--OXYGEN SENSOR

--AIRFLOW METER OR MAP SENSOR

--IGNITION

--ECU

--
26
AIR/FUEL RATIO RICH INDICATOR
--SAME AS ABOVE

--COLD START INJECTOR

--
27
SUB-OXYGEN SENSOR CIRCUIT OR SUB-OXYGEN SENSOR HEATER CIRCUIT
--SUB OXYGEN SENSOR/HEATER/CIRCUIT

--ECU

--
28
No.2 OXYGEN SENSOR/OXYGEN SENSOR HEATER
--SAME AS CODE 21

2
31
MANIFOLD AND/OR AIRFLOW METER SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT
--AIRFLOW METER/CIRCUIT

--MANIFOLD PRESSURE SENSOR/CIRCUIT

--ECU

--
32
AIRFLOW METER SIGNAL (VANE-TYPE)
--AIRFLOW METER./CIRCUIT

--ECU

14
34
TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE--ABNORMAL TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE
--TURBO CHARGER

--AIRFLOW METER/MANIFOLD/TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE SENSOR

--INTERCOOLER SYSTEM

--ECU

--
35
TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE SENSOR SIGNAL
--TURBOCHARGER PRESSURE SENSOR

--ECU

7
41
THROTTLE POSITION SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN TPS SIGNAL
--TPS SENSOR

--TPS SIGNAL/CIRCUIT

--ECU

9
42
VEHICLE SPEED SENSOR SIGNAL CIRCUIT--NO SPD. SIGNAL FOR SEVERLA SECONDS
WHILE VEHICLE IS OPERATED UNDER HEAVY LOAD (TPS/MAP/AIR FLOW INPUTS)

--SPEED SENSOR/CIRCUIT

--ECU

10
43
STARTER SIGNAL--NO "STA" SIGNAL TO ECU UNTIL ENGINE SPEED EXCEEDS 800RPM
--IGNITION SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--ECU

11
51
SWITCH SIGNALS
IDL (tps) CONTACTS OFF, NEUTRAL START SWITCH OFF, A/C SWITCH "ON" SIGNAL TO ECU

WITH DIAGNOSTIC CHECK CONNECTOR SHORTED

--A/C SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--A/C AMPLIFIER

--TPS/CIRCUIT

--NEUTRAL START SWITCH/CIRCUIT

--ECU

12
52
KNOCK SENSOR SIGNAL--OPEN OR SHORT IN KNOCK SENSOR SIGNAL
--KNOCK SENSOR/CIRCUIT

ECU

13
53
KNOCK CONTROL SIGNAL IN ECU
--ECU

--
71
EGR VALVE MALFUNCTION--EXHAUST GAS TEMPEATURE BELOW SPEC. FOR EGR CONTROL
--EGR SYSTEM

--EGR GAS TEMPERATURE SENSOR/CIRCUIT

- -
72
AIR CONDITIONER COMPRESSOR RELAY/RELAY SIGNAL
--A/C COMPRESSOR RELAY/CIRCUIT

--ECU

What are they saying - there can be up to 72 blips to count?
Why is there 2 different entries for 14 blips (for example)
That list is arranged like a madmans $hite

These are the website codes for 2LTE

1 - Normal
2 - Turbo boost pressure sensor
4 - Coolant temperature sensor
5 - Correction resistance (Pump)
6 - Pump speed sensor (Pump)
7 - Throttle position sensor
8 - Intake air temperature sensor
9 - Vehicle speed sensor
10 - Starter switch
11 - Switch sign (Vehicle not in P or N or A/C on)
12 - Timer control valve (Pump)
13 - Crank position sensor

[Fish]

After getting rid of my transit van 10 months after engine conversion (went from a 2.5 72psi to a 100psi 2.5tdi), found a diesel engine will still idle and apear to run fine with a cam belt jumped a tooth, but will smoke and be a little gutless and a little more tappy, just what you describe, so check m8, it may be your tensioner isnt working and under a little bit more load than usual has allowed the belt to jump. And as long as the valves havent rattled on the piston tops you should be OK after a belt/tensioner change.

Fish

[lucky]

Sounds like timing to me. My understanding of diesel engines is as follows.

Timing too far retarded - engine quiet but gutless.
Timing spot on - engine noisy but loads of grunt.
Timing too far advanced - engine really noisy and gutless.

Sounds like the belt jumped a tooth or stripped one.

cheers